The Power of His Presence

0:00 Why is the gospel so offensive? It's offensive because it shows you up. The gospel is offensive because it's a loud and giant declaration, you're not all that. You need saving. And you are helpless and powerless to save yourself. You can give God nothing. You can't contribute anything to his already finished work. Welcome to the City Light Church podcast. Thanks for joining us today as we look into God's Word and discover the hope and truth that He has for us. If you want to connect with City Light Church, feel free to visit us at CityLightNYC.com.

0:41 That's CityLightNYC.com. Pastor Boyan Jancic and his team believe that the power of the Holy Spirit is already working in our hearts and minds. As you listen to today's teaching, remember that you are deeply loved by God, that you are surrounded by His grace, and that He has a real hope and a future for you. Speaking of experiences. Because baptism is an experience. And Jesus encountered the Holy Spirit at his baptism. Speaking of experiences, during worship, I was just thinking, everything in our economy is based on an experience.

1:21 Like right now, I really want to sell my current car and buy the new Tesla Roadster. Because it will give me a unique experience, you know? You never know when you might want to go up some walls and hit those thrusters. I checked out the website. They want a $500,000 deposit. I might just delay that a little bit. But you know, they're selling an experience. You'll go to Disney World, spend thousands of dollars for what? An experience. Even when they advertise food, you know, they always zoom in on the person's face.

2:02 Their eyes are like rolling in the back of their head. They're selling an experience. Why? Because we want experiences. As a child, I wanted to have an experience with the supernatural. I was introduced, not heavily, but the door was open from the culture I came from and what was happening in America in the 80s. I was introduced to the New Age movement, which is occultic and witchcrafty. But I sensed something. It wasn't good, I later realized. But I sensed something that was more than this physical and natural that I could touch. And I liked it.

2:42 All of a sudden, I had a hunger for the supernatural. Supernatural. Super means above. Something above the natural. Something otherworldly. And then when I was 16 years old, in Forest Hills High School, in 10th grade, my friend, Elena Chan, she got radically saved. And her eyes looked different. Her countenance was different. I remember in class, she looked over her shoulder, and I saw her eyes. They looked like two pieces of coal glowing. I knew she was talking about some church thing. She was Chinese and she wasn't Buddhist. She was just kind of like nothing. So she...

3:23 I just knew she was nothing. And some people were talking to her about church. And I saw her look totally different. And in the hallway, I said, Elena, what happened to you? And she said, I got baptized last night. And look what I can do. She started speaking in tongues in the hallway. In Forest Hills High School. And when she did that, I felt something. And I knew she had an experience. She looked like she had an experience. She talked like she had an experience. And she invited me to church, and I went to that church, and that's how I radically got saved. And I had an experience of my own. I encountered the Holy Spirit. Experiences are necessary.

4:04 There's a value to experiences. A man with a theory is never at the mercy of a man with an experience. I meet people all the time. It's really funny when you're a pastor because you meet people and they always think they're the first one telling you something. And you're like, oh, I heard this a thousand times before. And they think they're going to like make your whole faith fall apart with some statement they saw a meme about three years ago. They're like, huh? How about? Well, Cain killed Abel, right? And then Cain got married, right? Where did Cain's wife come from? Oh, my God. I never considered that. Everything is falling apart.

4:45 My whole life has been a lie. Where does Cain's wife come from? You know, where does she come from? The answer is there were others. But anyway, that's a whole other sermon. But I'm not threatened because I've had too many experiences. They got a theory. They got a philosophy. But I had experiences. You can't take that away. And God wants every single one of you to have an experience. You look throughout the scriptures. Hundreds of God's people. They have one thing in common. They had an experience.

5:27 Abram. Turning into Abraham. He had an experience with God. Jacob. Wrestled with the angel of the Lord who was the Lord himself. He had an experience with God. Moses had an experience. Joshua had an experience. Gideon, before he did anything, he had an experience. Paul had an experience. The disciples had an experience. Even Jesus, who's our ultimate example, he didn't do any mighty work until he had an experience in the waters of baptism. Came up out of the water, and the Holy Spirit came upon him. The anointing came upon him.

6:08 He experienced the presence and power of the Lord. I know this is a little trippy because he's God. But he laid his divinity down. It's a paradox. If anyone can explain it to you perfectly, they're off. Because it's kind of like trying to think about the universe too long. Your mind just starts to go on tilt. But he did. He laid his divinity down. So when he performed miracles, he didn't do it as God Almighty. He did it as a human anointed by the Holy Spirit. And he wasn't anointed by the Holy Spirit until his baptism where he had an experience. So God wants you to have an experience. And last week I started ministering on this. I noticed first service was difficult.

6:50 First service was plowing. I mean, I've been to the Arctic, by the way. In 2002, I did a six-village tour of the Arctic. But still, I would say, there is no colder place in the world than any first Sunday service in most churches in America. Even churches that are full gospel and flow in the Holy Ghost, people just come in all. So it was different second service. But also, the anointing builds. The anointing compounds. So second service was juicier than the first service. If we had a third service, it would have been juicier than the second service. Whoa, if we had a fourth, you see where I'm going with this. The anointing builds, the anointing compounds. And I saw the Lord beginning to do things, and I really want to just really embrace what he's doing, because we cannot, we must protect the anointing at all costs.

7:41 We must protect the move of the Holy Spirit at all costs, because God forbid that we become a dead, dry, frontal, low-bearing church. And there are a lot, I don't say this from an elitist standpoint, but, When I say there are a lot, you know, I don't want it to be like I'm on the mountain going, oh, there are a lot down there. You know that meme of the aristocrats that are peering over the balcony, smugly looking down? That's not my posture, I promise you. But there are a lot. How do I know? Because I talk to them all the time. I meet them. A lot of Christians who are frontal lobeian. the area of your brain that's for analysis.

8:22 And that's how they relate to God, with their brain. But he's the Holy Spirit, not the holy brain. So you will not comprehend him with your unholy brain, with your analysis, with your logic. You will not understand him. It's a spirit to spirit relationship. And in order to have that relationship, when you start to engage the Holy Spirit, you're going to experience him. So I'm grateful for my experiences. I know for a fact I would not be here had I not, and continually experience. And when I say, you know, I give these examples from the past because...

9:02 They're so dramatic, and that's how I was formed as a disciple, and that's how I entered into Christianity. But if I go one week without experiencing, you're going to see a very sad bow. Very, very, my face starts to look like a horse. Very long. Just, I'm grumpy, I'm cranky. Two weeks, I'm a flesh monster. You're like, good morning, what do you want? I need that oil. Otherwise I get all creaky and squeaky. If you don't believe me, ask my wife. She'll tell you. Hallelujah. Gotta have fresh encounters with the Lord. Hallelujah. I want to read this to you from 2 Corinthians chapter 12.

9:48 Paul just talking about the Christian life. And I just love how he words this as he begins 2 Corinthians 12. We're just going to read this one verse. It is doubtless not profitable for me to boast. I will come. I will discuss. I will come. That's what it means. I'm going to talk to you about visions and revelations of the Lord. Because he had encounters. And he begins to describe this encounter. In fact, can we read the rest? I just want you to receive that phrase. Visions and revelations of the Lord. How many of you want visions and revelations of the Lord? I want that. I want greater visions and revelations. I want to know him.

10:28 That's what first excited me about Christianity. Was this notion that I could know God. Because I always felt, even though I wasn't saved, I bet a lot of you are like this way too. From being a small child, I had some kind of desire for God. But I didn't know who he was, what he was. It was always misplaced, but I had a sense there is a God in heaven. There is a creator. There is a supreme being. If it's possible, I would like to know him. But I didn't know. I didn't know I could know him until I heard about the invitation that I can know God through Jesus Christ. thrilled me.

11:08 I can have him as a friend, have him as a father, talk to him, experience him. I can have him fill me, fill my life. I could see his effects in my life. I can then have a well-lived, victorious life because he's flowing through me. I know a man in Christ who 14 years ago, he's talking about himself, by the way. Whether in the body I do not know or whether out of the body I do not know. That means when the ushers caught him, he didn't even know whether he was in his body or having an out-of-body experience. He doesn't really care. He just knows he had a God encounter.

11:50 God knows. God knows. That's what I'm saying. Who cares? God knows. That's all that's important. Such a one was caught up to the third heaven. The third heaven is what we just call heaven, the abode of God. He specifically says third heaven. Because the Hebrews had a term, the first heaven was the sky, the stratosphere. The second heaven was the cosmos. The third heaven is the abode of God. And I know such a man, whether in the body or out of the body, I do not know, God knows, how he was caught up into paradise and heard inexpressible words, which is not lawful for a man to utter. Amen. Of such a one I will boast, yet of myself I will not boast except in my weaknesses.

12:34 For though I might desire to boast, I will not be a fool, for I will speak the truth. But I refrain, lest anyone should think of me above what he sees me to be or hears from me. Here's just what I want you to see, that the Apostle Paul had this phenomenal encounter. Yet many of them, he's just talking about one right here. We don't know which one he's talking about. People say, oh, that's the one where he got saved. That's the one where he got the revelation of grace. Who knows? It could have been last Tuesday for him. Well, actually, it says 14 years ago. But he had these encounters on the regular. He was refreshed in the Holy Spirit. We know that, because being refreshed and filled with the Holy Spirit is a continuous thing. Hallelujah. Hallelujah.

13:18 The purpose, so I can just say it like explicitly, the purpose of this meeting is to move you further along in encountering God. Hallelujah. Some of you know what it's like to experience him. Some of you experienced him on the way to church this morning. For some of you who know, it's been a while. Others, you don't even know what's available. You've had that frontal lobe in Christianity. You're trying to relate to him based only on the written word. I'm not knocking the written word. Thank God for his written word. The written word takes precedence.

14:01 I acknowledge the written word. But the written word is not all we have. All word, you dry up. All spirit, you blow up. You put the two together, and you grow up. And when there's church on Sundays, you'll show up. When the rapture takes place, you'll go up. Tithes and offerings are taken up, you'll pay up. Hallelujah. But the Holy Spirit is wine, the word is bread. And they go really well together. Hallelujah.

14:45 I want to show you something from Matthew. Matthew chapter 5, verses 33 to 37. Verse 37. I want to talk to people who have labeled themselves difficult to receive. Because Satan wants to keep you from experiencing God. He wants to keep you a stranger to the anointing. A stranger to the Holy Spirit. Because then you have a powerless Christianity. Really get to be good friends with the Holy Spirit. Study who the Holy Spirit is. Hint, he's God. He's often called the third member of the Godhead.

15:27 The Bible doesn't call him the third member of the Godhead. But theologians, he's the third, which I never really liked because it almost puts him like he's in third place in prominence or importance. Like the Father's really important. Jesus, you can't knock him. But the Holy Spirit, well, he's the third. He's got the bronze medal. The Father's got the gold. Jesus smiling next to him with his silver. They're one God. They're one God manifested in three persons, And the Holy Spirit is just as much God as the Father is God, and the Holy Spirit is just as much God as the Son is God. And for whatever reason, people keep the Holy Ghost at arm's length.

16:07 He's weird, he's spooky, he's different, they feel he's unknowable. You can know him. What's he like? You want to know what he's like? He's exactly like Jesus. You know why? Because the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ. Jesus is so wonderful, so loving, so gentle, so kind. That's how the Holy Spirit is. And he's worth knowing. I once heard this, and I believe it's true, it's sad, but true, that if the Holy Spirit were to leave the church, 80 plus percent of the churches would just continue on as usual. In other words, they're not relying on the Holy Spirit.

16:50 And they would just continue on with their programs, with their incestuous, bless me clubs. By incestuous, I just mean it's always the same 12 people nobody ever knew comes in and just keep their little tight group. Weird. If the Holy Spirit left, we'd be shut down within 24 hours, if we even make it that far. We need him. We're sustained by him. Hallelujah. So you get to decide that. how much you want to get to know the Holy Ghost. And it takes you letting go and being a little brave.

17:34 Because the one who will teach you how to get to know the Holy Spirit, you ready for this? It's the Holy Spirit. You can pick up some notes, hopefully, from my examples, from the scriptures that I use. You can see how other people pray, how other people encounter him, but you can't mimic that. The Holy Spirit will be your guide to the Holy Spirit. You just have to make yourself available. You have to be hungry. That's why I stress the importance of an experience. Paul stressed the importance of an experience when he prayed for the Ephesians. And you know what he prayed? He said, I pray that you would experience.

18:14 I pray that you would experience the love of God. Amen. which cannot be intellectually known. It must be experienced. Taste and see that the Lord is good is an experience. It's an invitation to an experience. He didn't say, go read how good the Lord is. No. Try it for yourself. Taste and see that the Lord is good. You know what I just thought of? I just flashed. I'm five years old. I'm in the country for about three months. And I'm at my mother's work. She worked for Hugo Bank, which I always want to chuckle because it was the Yugoslavian bank and I just find it funny it was called Hugo Bank.

18:55 But anyway, she worked for Hugo Bank. And they brought out this food I had never seen. It looked absolutely disgusting. It was triangular, droopy, white, nasty looking, and a little plastic cup filled with this brown liquid. And they said, have some. I said, no way. I said, no, no, no, you'll like it, have some. I was like, no way. I still, just like it happened five minutes ago. It was pizza and Coke. I'd never seen anything like it. It was gross looking. And I took a bite of that pizza, it was a little hot. So I quickly washed it down with Coke.

19:35 My eyes dilated. My eyes dilated. My life had forever been changed. Everything was different. I will never forget that moment. And the reality is that since then I have been hunting for that initial high. I've been hunting. I'm going from pizzeria to pizzeria. I want to just relive that one experience I had when I was five years old. But what happened was I had tasted for myself. I had seen. I thought, God bless America. This immigrant has come. This is wonderful. I've crossed the Atlantic.

20:16 I have been rewarded. But the invitation for you is to taste and see. It's an experience. So some people just don't know. Well, if you don't know, now you know. Now you know. He's available. But I've looked at this for years. Why do some people have a hard time entering in? They've labeled themselves as hard to receive. And there's a lot of symptomatic things, but they all have the same root.

20:59 And the root is control. Because I can talk about the symptoms. You know, a lot of times we hack at the fruit and leave the roots intact. Because someone can say, oh, the culture, oh, they're shy, they're inhibited, they're worried what other people will think, all that. But really the root of all that is control. And in order to experience God, you have to give up your control. By the way, that's one of the greatest themes of the entire Bible. The gospel is called the gospel of Christ. You know what else it's called? Paul calls it the gospel of offense.

21:41 The gospel is offensive. Why is it offensive? What's so offensive about the gospel? When I first got saved, I would read about how offensive the gospel is. And I would think maybe because Jesus was all bloody and beat up on the cross and that's offensive to people. Oh, you got to turn your head. Why is the gospel so offensive? It's offensive because it shows you up. The gospel is offensive because it's a loud and giant declaration. You're not all that. You need saving. And you are helpless and powerless to save yourself. You can give God nothing. You can't contribute anything to his already finished work.

22:24 And that's deeply offensive because we as people are deeply proud. And we're deeply so proud that we're self-sufficient even though we're actually a walking mess. But we hide that and pretend we're something. And the gospel constantly declares, you're nothing, but surrender your life to Christ and he makes you in him everything. So in that way, the gospel is offensive. The Holy Spirit in a similar way is offensive because you have to give up control. And you have to realize that you're not all that.

23:06 And you've got to break and yield and allow him to fill you. Now, here's a passage from the Sermon on the Mount. Matthew 5, 33. You want to have a fun time? Read the Gospels all over again. And read them from a lens of how much time Jesus takes trying to help people get past themselves. really messing with their pride, their independence, their self-sufficiency. That's why so many hated him.

23:47 Pharisees hated him because they were very proud. And he showed them to be like little kids. Not the good little kids, but little clowns running around. Again you have heard that it was said to those of old, you shall not swear falsely, but shall perform your oaths to the Lord. But I say to you, do not swear at all, neither by heaven nor by heaven. For it is God's throne, nor by earth, for it is his footstool, nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great king. I'm talking about receiving the Holy Spirit.

24:28 I'm talking about eliminating pride and how offensive the things of God are. I'm not talking about swearing. But you'll see what I'm talking about and what Jesus is talking about because they're interrelated. Nor shall you swear by your head, because you cannot make one hair white or black. So here's what Jesus is saying. Don't make promises. Don't swear. For whatever reason, kids, little kids, come like prepackaged this way. Like when they want to show you that they really, really mean something, they'll go, no, dad, I promise. I swear. And so we had the teacher go, oh, don't promise.

25:10 Don't swear. Jesus goes on to say, just let your yeses be yeses, your noes be noes. In other words, your word should be so full of integrity that you don't have to promise, but you tell somebody, I'll be there at three, they can take it to the bank. Don't be one of those people that texts. Five to three. Sorry, running 12 minutes late. What did you do 20 years ago? Anyway, sorry. Goose frappe. So Jesus is talking to a group of Hebrews who had a habit of swearing, making promises. And he says, don't do that. And then some of them will realize I shouldn't swear on my life.

25:53 You know, people, I swear on my life. No, I really mean it. I swear on my mother's life. He's saying, some of you, you realize that's wrong, so now you're swearing by something less. You're swearing by your own head. And this is just how he sums everything up. You don't have power to turn one hair white or black. You use just for men. You have to go to the salon and pay big money for a hair dye job. You can't even change the color of your hair. And you're swearing by your own head? In other words, I don't want to lose you. Jesus is saying, you don't have any power. You don't have any power.

26:33 And get comfortable with understanding you're not all that. Who are you swearing something where you have no power? The other day my daughter said, Dad, I promise I'll never ever do that again. I said, well, you're going to do that in about five minutes then. I said, what do you mean? I've been trying to teach you this. Well, because you just promised that you're never going to do that again. So you're saying you're strong enough and you're disciplined enough to never ever do that again. She's thinking. I said, instead say, Dad, I'm going to surrender to God and by his help I won't ever do that again. You think that's just a change in semantics? It's a completely different heart posture.

27:15 Have you ever promised God, I will never do that again? We're doing it the next day? Or God, I'm really going to do that. That was three years ago. You still haven't done that? Because you're full of pride. And you're not the only one. We're all in this boat. Relating this to receiving from the Holy Spirit. The message of God is an offensive message because it constantly shows you up and it leads you to a place where you recognize, I'm not that powerful. I'm not that strong. I need to let go to the greater one.

27:56 This is how you encounter the Lord. This is what will help you in having visions and visitations and revelations from the Lord. This is how you will grow in the anointing. This is how you'll experience the power of God. When you quit trying to be so in control. And you actually surrender. Knowing you're not all that. So that's actually the root. Then we can talk about the symptoms. People who say, oh, that's just not my personality. Who cares what your personality is? I say that with love, but really, what do you mean that's not your personality? Is that your impersonality to encounter God? Well, I saw somebody encountering God, and they were crying. They were laughing.

28:37 They were really loud. And, you know, I'm kind of quiet. You don't know what you are in God's presence. Oh, my culture, I don't, how about the Bible culture? My culture is quiet. No, it isn't. I don't care what culture you come from, you say it's a quiet culture. Go to a flea market in your culture. Take the quietest culture and put its finger in the doors of the F train. All of a sudden, the quiet person is like, you can't be out of here now. What happened to your quiet culture?

29:19 Oh, you had an experience. You were moved. Oh, you were touched by the F train, huh? And now all of a sudden, you're loud. I thought your culture was quiet. Really respectful and dignified. Oh. Hallelujah. You know, I was going to tell you, I was going to call you up before service, but the Lord said it doesn't matter. So can you just come up, Natalie, and just hand her a mic?

29:59 And can I ask you a few questions, and then you can freestyle. But let me just, come right up here. Let me just ask you a few questions. I just wanted a few people just to share their story. State your full name and what you like to do, like long walks on the beach. No, I'm kidding. I'm kidding. That was just a throwback to 80s game shows. Okay. Were you born into a Christian home? Yes. What kind of Christian home? A religious Christian home. Did you go to church? How many times a year did you go to church? Every Sunday until I became of age where they allowed me to decide, which I think was like...

30:44 12, around there, and then they let me say no. And then you said no? Where were you raised? Where? Where? Oh, Southern California. You're kidding. See, I'm getting to know Natalie after all these years. I had no idea. Southern California. Such a pleasant place. It is a very pleasant place. Like, you can be at a stop sign and there's avocados growing. You just pick one right off. Incredible. And so when did you get saved saved? 2021 in this church. 2021. And then now I'll let you freestyle.

31:24 Tell us a little bit. So now you get saved. How did you encounter the Holy Spirit? What was that like? Anything that comes to mind? How you went from, so not walking with the Lord, then you make a decision for Christ, and then you kind of jump in the river with both feet up sticking out, the river being the Holy Spirit. Yeah, absolutely. So I think it kind of even pertains to what you just asked me about, you know, growing up in a Christian home and then, you know, making that decision to say no. Because I grew up in religion. And so I didn't have – I didn't even know you could encounter Jesus. And so it was just so dry. It was so rote.

32:05 It was so boring. It was just – Yeah, it was just, it was devoid of experience. And so, you know, once I was able to say no, I was like, I don't, you know, what benefit does that have for my life? And then it wasn't until I kind of hit rock bottom that I was like, oh yeah. Cause you think about what the word of God says. And it does say, if you raise up a child in the ways he should go, you will not depart from it. And so all of those seeds of the time in Sunday school were in me. And so it was like, oh, hey, you know, maybe let me cry out to the Lord. Let's, you know, see what he has to say about this or what's going on. And it was in COVID because of everything that was going on. There was just, I was personally experiencing so much fear. And I kind of had this realization that I was like, you know what, if the world, because it's like, I do think that the way that we're wired is we do know that heaven and hell is real.

32:53 I truly believe that. And so there was still this understanding that I don't want to go to hell. I want to go to heaven, but I want to also live my life the way that I want to live it and then just like get into heaven, which is not the way that Jesus encourages us and commands us to live. And so it was in that time of fear that I was like, you know, I really think that if I was faced with that, you know, is my just saying I know that Jesus is real enough and I don't believe that it is. And so I had to experience him. And so it was kind of a, gosh, how long has it been now? Five, six years? kind of journey into just encountering him and it was through it was through getting baptized in the holy spirit what was that like okay yeah let's talk about that but getting baptized in the holy spirit you were saved that i remember because you were saved just a little bit like a few weeks few months no like yeah a few weeks a few weeks And then Emily and I said, hey, you need to be filled with the Holy Spirit.

33:49 Yeah, it was. So I had joined the church like right around before you announced 21 days of prayer and fasting. And I don't know what inside me was like, oh, yeah, you know, I'm brand new, but I'm going to fast and pray for 21 days with the church. And you had just casually mentioned the baptism of the Holy Spirit in like the beginning intro of going into prayer. And I was like, what's that? And so I had sought you after a Friday night service. Okay, set it with you. So you sought me after. See, some of you have heard me use certain phrases, and you go, I don't know what that is. Anyway, I wonder what's on TV tonight. Who's playing tonight? But when you're hungry, the evidence of desire is in pursuit.

34:31 Yeah. So she goes, I don't know what is the baptism of the Holy Spirit, but I'm going to ask. So I forgot that part. You asked me? Yeah. And so I got you before service was done on a Friday night, and you had given me the red and blue pill. And then you said, read this and then book an appointment with me. So we have a mini book. It's a red book and a blue book. You should read those. And we jokingly refer to them from the Matrix as the red pill and the blue pill. Take both pills. Okay. And then so we set up an appointment and it was right over there. I remember that. And it was right before the women's conference. And I remember like you were praying, the best thing ever. I don't know if you remember this. You were like, oh, wow, there's a lot of cobwebs.

35:13 And I was like, okay. I was like, I don't know what that means, but okay. And I just remember in my conscious mind, I was so uncomfortable because it was like the worship team was practicing. And I was like, they can hear me if I start praying. I don't know what this is like. And I was so locked up in myself. Just to clarify. No, because I know what you're saying. But one thing you'll see as you speak more, people don't at all know what you're saying, but we know what we're saying. But they weren't there. So she made an appointment, and I was like, well, like, just come before service starts. And it was the women's conference. So worship team is rehearsing. People are moving and setting up the sanctuary. And my wife and Natalie and me are right there.

35:57 And so, you know, it was less than ideal, right? Ideally, you want your privacy. You want to have light music gently playing in the background. Maybe two ladies around you with hankies, right? But it was messy. And you got... It was very public, which... Very public. Which, that wasn't you back then. Okay. And so now it's funny that I said, the Lord's getting rid of the cobwebs, knowing that you grew up in religion and tradition, because those are the cobwebs he was sweeping away. So you got really baptized in the Holy Spirit. Yes. And when I say really, obviously, it's either you get baptized, or you don't receive, you're just delayed.

36:38 But I just remember it took like five seconds. I was like, open your mouth, receive and speak in tongues. And Natalie just started speaking in tongues, full blast. What was that like, crossing over? Yeah. Because you didn't just cross over, you slipped right in. What were you thinking? That it was exactly what I was missing all my life. Wow. That's awesome. Hallelujah. That's awesome. I think that helped a lot of people. Luke, can you just come and share a little bit? Thank you, Jesus. I wonder if I should ask you some questions, but I don't think I will.

37:18 I think I'll just let you talk. Well, one of the things I said in the first service is it occurs to me that everybody here knows me from City Light and knows me kind of sometimes acting a little goofy or crazy up at the front and being super into church. That's not who I thought I was my whole life. I didn't. I'm not naturally like that, that as far as I knew I grew up. Always going to church, always feeling like I knew what was going on, but very religious, never having those types of experiences with God. But something that I would like to highlight is when the Lord did start encountering me through this church, through City Light, I started falling in love with God's presence, which I actually didn't even know that I could experience God's presence, that that was a real thing.

38:11 And when I started experiencing his presence, I realized that in his presence is the fullness of joy that I was looking for. In his presence is life. In his presence is love. And all these things that I was missing my whole life, even revelation and understanding on who Jesus is, we can't understand that apart from the presence of the Holy Spirit. I think it's easy to see people like... When I first came to City Light, it was like a few months after Natalie got saved, I guess, but I didn't know that. And then I just saw her acting the way that she did. And I was like, this person is a super Christian who's been here forever. And then I just found out that she had only just got saved. But it's easy to look at people having an experience of the Holy Spirit and be like, wow, that must be nice, you know?

38:58 But it's not like... For me, it wasn't so... easy, you know? It was a challenge. He only gave me a very small taste at first. At first, it was when I was... I remember the first time it happened, I started feeling a slight warm glow on the inside of me while I was reading the book of Acts. And then the next day I was like, wow, I wonder if, I think that was God, you know, that seemed like it was God. Let me see if I could get that again. And so I went and sure enough, the same thing happened the second day. And then the third day I was like, wow, can't wait for it to happen again. And it didn't happen, you know, and I just stayed there. I was like, no, I think this was God.

39:39 I remember it took me an hour of reading the word and then it slowly started to come back. And I was like, he's back, you know. And I think of even in the Song of Solomon, like it's not so cut and dried. Like it's kind of weird. She knocks on the door. Yeah, yeah. This is great. You didn't share this stuff in the first service. And this is something I preached on 20 years ago. Hold on. There's a lot in that last one sentence he said. He experiences the Lord in a subtle way, very little. And he recognizes it's the Lord. Of course, there's always some doubt. You might think maybe it's just me. Maybe I'm just feeling a feeling. But it's deeper than that, so you pursue it the next day, and you get rewarded with his presence the next time.

40:24 Then you pursue it again, and for whatever reason, it's like you get nothing. And all this doubt creeps in, and maybe like spiritual insecurity creeps in. And then you're about to talk about the Song of Solomon. Yeah, well... I'm sorry, I just want to set the stage. So the Song of Solomon, it's not erotic scripture. It is the pursuit of a groom and his bride. And it is a picture of Christ and the church. And it's supposed to be how we relate to the Lord, how the Lord relates to us. And I'm sure what you were going to say is there's various instances of how he pursues her.

41:06 But at one point, he comes to her and he puts his hands on the lattice to take a look at her. And she goes, oh, my love, my dove. There he is. And as she turns around, he's gone. And she goes pursuing after him. In other words, it would appear that at times God is elusive himself. But he's not running away from you, he's running for you. Because he wants to see how much you want him. Because you only treat something as precious that you have to pursue. Everyone who ever got anything from Jesus, they actually pursued him.

41:52 Show me one that just got something in it. Blind Bartimaeus. He said, son of David, have mercy on me. And everyone, the Bible says everyone said, shh. They told him to shut up. And the Bible says he cried out all the more, Son of David, have mercy on me. See, when they told him shut up, nine out of ten people went, oh, sorry. But he had to pursue. He was so hungry that at the risk of socially being ostracized, he raised his voice. We talked about the woman with the issue of blood. What about the paralytics? They couldn't get, a lot of people would go, oh, look.

42:32 Jesus, there's a crowd like 19 deep around him. You can't get to him. But they're like, no, I know. Take me up to that man's house and rip the roof off and lower me to Jesus. There's always a pursuit. Even when the Holy Spirit fell right on the day of Pentecost... Jesus said, wait. The day of Pentecost is 50 days after Passover. So they were waiting for days and days and days. You don't think they ever had the thought, what are we even doing? Maybe we should just go home. But they waited, and the first church, our church, the church of the Lord Jesus Christ, was birthed.

43:14 Because people pressed in and were hungry enough to wait for the release of the Holy Spirit. So go on with your story. Wow. I mean, one anecdote that comes to me is I started beginning to experience God here at City Light in the services and worship. Little tastes here and there. And I wanted to have those. Something in me knew I could experience him every day. I could experience him on my own like that. But I couldn't break through it. And one of the things that I started doing is I realized if I went to Anika's Life Group in Brooklyn... I realized if I could get around Anika, I could experience God, you know, during those times.

43:55 And then even when I went home, the next day there'd be some residual. And I remember... that one of the times we were there, there was this dog, and Natalie, like, was going to go give it a treat or something like that, and then this dog just started doing everything that it could think of, like, it started doing tricks, rolling around, you know, trying to look cute, you know, and running back and forth, I was like, that reminds me of me trying to get to the presence of God, because I had no idea what I was doing, you know, it's like, let me try worship, No, let me try reading the word. Let me try putting on preaching. You know, because I was pursuing him, and a lot of times it wasn't working. But, and he didn't tell me, there wasn't any one way to do it.

44:38 Every day was different. I was trying to find him every day. So that was kind of how it started for me, was just a back and forth pursuit. But I think God really will test us to see it. are you willing to go to Brooklyn from Washington Heights on the subway to go to a life group? Because you think, just maybe I might meet God there, you know. Is the pursuit worth it then? It's been so worth it, you know. So worth it. Amen. Put your hands together for Luke. Thank you. You know, I realize it takes different strokes for different folks. So I want you to hear different stories.

45:19 Is this helping you? Uni, I'd love to hear from you. Can I ask you a few questions? Can you and Kwok come up? I'd just like to ask you a couple of questions. Just come up. I'll just ask you a couple of questions. Now, Uni, Kwok is a member here, also a dear friend of mine. We've been cycling together. Getting closer on those trails. But here, here's a microphone. I'm just going to ask you a few questions, because I'm going to go back to the first time we had dinner together, and I heard your story. So let's just go back 10 years, because you came to City Light in 22? 21 or 22?

45:59 21. November 6th, 21? You know what else was November 6th, 21? No, the Bitcoin high was November 6th, 2021. Just amazing that you came that day. It was $69,800. I received that. Okay. So, let's say 10 years ago, were you Christian? Yes, I was born into a Christian family. You were born into it. Kwok, you were not, right? Actually, I was baptized in 2002. 2002? 2002, right before we got married. Wow. A sprinkle. Okay, so you made a sprinkle, but you made three sprinkles.

46:41 Okay. A little thing. And then what kind of a relationship did you have with the Lord? Religious. Religious. What does that mean? It means you go to, you do. You do. You do. Do, do, do, do. That's a lot of do, do. If you don't, you're going to get punished. What a way to live, to serve the Lord. And for a lot of people, that's just normal. If you don't do, you will be punished. So then your motivation in doing is to avoid punishment, which is anti-Christ. It's anti-gospel. Because do you notice when I receive the tithes, I never say, you need to give or God is going to smite you.

47:29 You know, you need to give or God will put a stranglehold on your finances. And he's really going to choke you out. Because then I'm basically Vinny from the mob. And I'm telling you that you need to pay protection money to God or he's going to break both your kneecaps. That's not how it works. We do things out of a love motive. I don't want you to give to avoid punishment. Give because, yes, there is blessing associated with giving, but give because of a love motive. Come to church because you love God, not because you're avoiding punishment. Okay. Was this a Korean church? It was an English-speaking Korean church.

48:09 Okay. Now, let me just say this. This is a lot of Asian people that I meet. They come from very legalistic. Would you say that? That's accurate? Legalistic. 100%. And like the love of God is almost a foreign concept, right? Like you know he loves you, but it's a harsh love. They know they honor the Lord, but there's no power of the Holy Spirit. That was a missing part. Wow. They become very legalistic. You know, listen to what she said. It's so true. She said, there's no power of the Holy Spirit, so they become very legalistic.

48:50 That's what I was taught in Bible school. That once the Holy Spirit leaves, all you have is legalism and religion. And you can't have both together. So you show me a legalistic and religious place, and I'll show you a place without the life of the Holy Spirit. Because then all you have is rules and rituals and tradition and legalism. So what happened? You're going there. And then I tried my best, of course, right? And then I became trying best Christian and cultural Christian at the same time. But I know I never doubted Jesus.

49:32 like my whole life. So I know he has chosen me, and then it was always inside of me. And he was talking to me. I just didn't realize it was his voice. And I knew he was talking to me, and he was revealing Holy Spirit to me, slowly, like drip, little by little. And then I just fell for it. So what do you do? Just because some people, they don't get it. He was revealing drip by drip the Holy Spirit to you. How? Like in prayer, when you're laying in bed? How was he doing this? He knows my desire. It's just he gave me the desire to know him.

50:15 And I didn't even realize it. So he's very sneaky that way, right? So he just gave me desire and made me think that it was me. But it wasn't me. Yeah, and then slowly, slowly, do you want to know who you're missing? And, like, little by little through pastors, I never knew, like, if online. And I was reading the books, reading the revelation, which I shouldn't be, but I was searching for him. And through that, he revealed so many different ways, right? conspiracy theory I went there too yeah yeah because I'm searching for the truth sure and that ended up Jesus Holy Spirit I found him yeah and that's the history that's that's new beginning on my life yeah and then and then obviously Kwok your husband came to and let's just hear from your daughter where's Kate the Great Come here, Kate the Great.

51:19 Thank you, guys. You can sit down. Let me talk to Kate the Great. Hey. So you were raised in that. Yeah. So what happened? You come here. What do you think? How old? Wait, how old? You're 20 now? I'm 20 now. And so you were 15 turning 16. 15 turning 16. Okay, were you baptized in the Holy Spirit? No, no, no. No. So I saw my parents growing in their faith slowly. It was a very slow and kind process that the Holy Spirit brought our family through.

52:00 So when mom was experiencing the Holy Spirit, especially watching our live stream on YouTube, me and dad would be in the room just like staring at her. And we'd just be looking at her. She's like crying, raising her hands. And we'd all be like, okay. I never heard this part. This is funny. Like, we would sneak off and go get breakfast while she was there. But I just had so much religion in my heart, because that's all I knew growing up in an ethnic church. And so when I was watching City Light livestream, seeing people just, like, raise their hands and go, just, like, be free in the presence of God, that was such an offending concept to me.

52:42 I thought, like, you're not honoring the Lord if you're not sitting... You actually had that thought. I had that thought. So this is no, because I forget this. I'm so used to, I'm hanging out with on fire Christians and I'm, you know, enjoying worship and I'll take the mic and I'll see three people scowling. I'll go, what? Like, what? How could they be in a bad mood? They could be having that same exact thought. Yeah, I've been there. Yeah. It's not a fun place to be. But I just, I remember it was the day that John and Carol were in. Like, what is it? You just think, like, they're being so, like, crass in the presence of God or they're being showy or whatever? Oh, no, it was just, like, my flesh just manifesting.

53:23 I didn't have control over it. I had no logical reason to be so upset, but yet I was so upset. See, you were sitting there, and you're like, why am I so angry at all these people? There's no logical reason. But it's the flesh. What's the flesh? It's that part of you not submitted to the Holy Spirit. And it's like, ah. Look, Jesus was the most awesome person, is and was when he walked this earth ever. And he would say something wonderful. And the Bible says they gnashed at him with their teeth. And you're really like, what's their problem? How would they... He didn't even say something that bad. Like, what's going on here? But that's how our flesh is. You present it with something truthful, divine, and beautiful, and you want to crucify that thing.

54:08 Yeah. Yeah. And so I stepped foot here, and then John and Carol were preaching, and it was the first time that I physically felt something different in the room. It felt so different than my old church. I was sitting right over there. I just remember not even being able to hold my head up. I felt like a newborn baby, just, like, sitting under this weighty presence. And I remember just, like, resting my head on my dad's shoulder because it just—the presence of God was so weighty in that room. And we left the service, and I felt a lift off. And I just knew there was something different here. And it was something that I wanted. It was something that felt incredibly safe. And now I know that was the presence of God. Wow. And seeing the worship team, just like everybody being so free and just sensing a unity and a heart to chase after what's real, after I've experienced so many fake things in my life.

55:01 And that really just, like, it started changing my mindset slowly. But once I really submitted my heart here, That is so awesome. The Lord changed my life. Yeah. That is wonderful. Wonderful. Thank you, Kate the Great. Thank you. So eloquent. So beautiful. So single. Kwok and I. Kwok and I are accepting applications. I'm not going to lie. You need to be a 10 out of 10. Thank you. emotionally stable, financially stable, proper, right, proper man of God. All right, this is a young, young princess.

55:42 She's got a lot of backup. You don't want to mess with that, I'm telling you right now. But I will be doing that wedding, amen. Hallelujah. Worship team, won't you come on up. Can you, Sean, can you play a song that I like? But I mean, I like them all, but one that I particularly like that you know. You know what, I never asked that before, right? But I just felt both, because I want to feel the anointing. Because I know if I feel the anointing, actually the people I pray for will feel the anointing. So I'm asking, that's the point of that.

56:25 Like when wind meets fire or everything you touch shall live. Or any of those. Any. Hallelujah. Thank you, Lord. Lord, there's people here. They need your touch. They didn't even know it was available. But now they know. I'm asking for your holy presence to come. Come and meet your people. Even now, move through the sanctuary.

57:06 Come upon people. Breathe on people. And bring life to dead things. I want to open up the altar for whoever wants prayer and ministry by the laying out of hands. I'd love to lay hands on you and minister to you. If you don't come up for prayer, I encourage you to then put your eyes on Jesus. Don't be a spectator, but put your eyes on Jesus and sing to him with all your heart. This is the City Light Church podcast. If you've missed any part of today's message, or if you would like to find out more about Pastor Boyan Jancic and City Light Church, visit us at CityLightNYC.com.

57:54 That's CityLightNYC.com. Feel free to visit us online or in person anytime. We would love to connect with you. We pray that you have been encouraged today, that you have been reminded how much God loves you, and that you are surrounded by grace. Thank you for listening. Make sure that you subscribe to City Light Church Podcast wherever you find your favorite podcasts worldwide.